Last edited on 03 September 2017 - 06:55 PM by Ny_

Congratulations to IAMPHIL, Macedon, Melyn, Danhookah, Jarl5026, xHeimskr, Suhji, Joyful, and ButIDK of Team Rome for taking home first place in today's NA 5v5 CTF tournament!

Diamond Series Invitationals:

Congratulations to Team Rome and Team PureBlox for being the first 2 teams to secure spots in the Badlion Diamond Series Invitationals! For our Capture the Wool and Domination tournaments, these two teams will still be allowed to compete for money, however they will not be able to "fill up" another Diamond Series spot - the top 2 teams who haven't already qualified will be selected. Keep in mind that the results in these tournaments can and will likely be used to seed the invitationals, and that we are watching closely to see who should fill the 2 extra reserved slots we've set aside to fill with teams who we believe deserve a chance to compete at the top level.

Call for Helpers:

These events wouldn't be possible without the help of the tournament staff team. However, in order to run more, bigger, and better tournaments, we need help. Right now we have 4 tournament advisers and 5 tournament helpers, which frankly isn't enough to run these events. We receive very few tournament staff applications, which means we don't have much of an application pool right now.

The position of tournament helper is a position with very relaxed expectations - we need your help with data entry for things like the roster spreadsheets we organize every tournament. We also need you to be available once a month or so on Saturday (and perhaps Sunday in the future) to help with day-of work such as setting up matches, watching them, and tracking them on Challonge. This job comes with the perks of being a staff member in addition to the ability to watch tournament matches live.

All are welcome to apply - current staff, non-staff, ex-competitive players, or those who have only watched a couple tournaments!

Find the application here!

Efficiency and Future Plans:

This tournament was run efficiently on our end, which was great, especially with how short-staffed we were. However, we're always looking for ways to run things better. The biggest flaw in my opinion, was that we didn't finish until just after 5pm EST, meaning the tournament in total lasted around seven hours. This is draining, both on the players, the live-streamers, and on the staff running it.

We are considering shifting to a two day tournament model for these sorts of events in the future. The basic concept is that Saturday, we require all teams to show up and play the first few rounds (this is when most of the DQs get pushed out of the way). Then Sunday, only the teams left in the tournament (so top 8/16/whatever we decide) show up to play the remaining rounds. We only stream the Sunday matches, which gives the streamers more exciting matches and ensures we are able to give the proper attention to promoting these tournaments to the level that they deserve. I would love to hear opinions on this, as this would require more of a commitment from everyone involved (including the teams) but would ultimately lead to a better tournament.

Veto System

We prepared a proper veto system for this tournament, with the idea of trying to keep things as competitive as possible. Unfortunately we had only sketched out a system for Bo3 prior to the tournament, so I created the rules for Bo3/5 in a hurry. Here were the rules used:

Bo1: Team A Veto 1 - Team B Veto 2 - Team A Veto 3 - Team B Veto 4

Bo3: Team A Veto 1 - Team B Veto 2 - Team B 1st Map Choice - Team A 2nd Map Choice

Bo5: Team A 1st Map Choice - Team B 2nd Map Choice - Team B 3rd Map Choice - Team A 4th Map Choice

This system was fair enough, but there were a couple flaws. First off, it was complicated to explain to people. Especially teams who were unfamiliar with veto processes and non-English teams had trouble understanding what was going on. It wasted a lot of time, particularly in early matches where games were typically one-sided anyway and vetoing often lasted longer than the actual match. Ideally, we would implement a GUI for vetoing, but for now we will just have to think of ways to try to make this more efficient. Personally, I think vetoing is essential for competitive gamemodes, but others may disagree that it's needed.

The veto system should 100% have been posted ahead of time to give teams time to think about how to approach vetoes, and so that they knew exactly how to approach it - obviously there's an issue if you have to choose the first map without knowing how the rest of the vetoing process will work. For that I apologize, next time I will make sure this is decided and posted the day before.

Lastly, the Bo5 system had the apparent flaw of favoring the lower-seeded team. Ensuring that your 2 of the first 3 matches are on your best maps is a definite advantage. While it didn't really affect the finals, which were a 3-0 sweep anyway, or the bronze match (Aura won on Boyz II Men's two selected maps, and Boyz II Men won on Aura's two), I still want to make sure in the future that this system is as balanced as possible.

Start Time

We have been discussing changing our usual start time. Typically, we start at 10am EST and run tournaments that last around 3-6 hours. If we shift to the 2 day model for longer tournaments, we can ensure that rather than seven hours in one day, we can make sure it runs no longer than four hours each day. This gives us more leeway for European players, as they won't have to worry about being up very late. Since the majority of our playerbase lies between NA-West and Central Europe, we could reasonably start at 12pm EST. This means NA-West starts at 9am instead of 7am (which I'm sure would be a welcome change) and Central European players would need to play from 6pm-10pm on Saturday, which seems reasonable.

This is still being discussed, but I'd love to hear everyone's opinions on changing this. How late is too late and how early is too early for a tournament?

Low Signups & High Attendance

Overall we only had 37 teams sign up for the tournament (actually a couple were added later and replaced 1st round no show teams for various reasons). This was much lower than we would've hoped, however we also had 68% turnout, which is our best ever for any tournament. The turnout is obviously great news, and is probably related to the low signups. Still though, we'd like to hear from the community: why were there so few signups for a $1000 tournament, and how can we encourage more teams to sign up for the next one?

Prizes:

[Rome - 1st - $650 & Invitational Spot]
IAMPHIL
Macedon
Melyn
Danhookah
Jarl5026
xHeimskr
Suhji
Joyful
ButIDK

[PureBlox - 2nd - $250 & Invitational Spot]
AdamChen
Loo
Subir
Ponca
dragonpasa
wylt
weaboo511
LoganPaulFan1

[Boyz II Men - 3rd - $100]
Albinooooooo
Chuchote
JettJones
pubmaster4000
DeltaDragon222
Zegita
Brandoff
Raaurem
anbu_

The above teams will be contacted regarding their prize money soon.
You can find the full results here: http://badlion.challonge.com/nactf5v5

We hope to see you all again at the 2v2 Debuff tournament on September 16th!

Last edited on 03 September 2017 - 05:47 PM by Ny_

Questions:

How was map pool?

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time.

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?

Posted on 03 September 2017 - 05:49 PM

-how was map pool? Looked pretty solid to me, good work.

-how was spawn timer? Can't answer fairly, didn't play much.

-how was livestream? Loved them, Maybe giving others an opportunity to give the two main guys a break? Seemed they were getting a tad bored at the end, and it was annoying when like three others joined the stream and were talking

-anything you want to see for ctw? Fair seeding so teams don't get knocked out by one of the top teams early. and good maps.

-thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? If you change it, make it so the person switching in did not play on any other team in any of the tournaments, IP check for alts too.

Great job.

Posted on 03 September 2017 - 06:07 PM

Automatically Deleted

Posted on 03 September 2017 - 06:10 PM

How was map pool?

Map pool was decent some maps such as Basilica played pretty much one sided unfortunately, having control of that gapple spawner gives the team a huge advantage then again you could argue that's the same with a lot of maps.

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?

Spawn timer was fine, never really paid much attention to it really because players would come in at the right time.

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time.

Livestream was great glad strangey took the time out of his day to do it I know it can be boring streaming for a good 7 hours but it was entertaining especially with Reshif's knowledge of just the gamemodes.

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?

Maybe new maps? I don't know if you guys are providing new maps for the tournament or continuing with the old ones. I would like to see some new good maps would be nice for a change.

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?

you should be able to switch out some players (2/3 max) if they can't make the dates.

Additional note: about the timing of the tournaments, I personally prefer having it done on one day just so it's out of the way and I don't need to think about it. It can be draining yes but that's why you have substitutes. It's good to cycle players out if that's the case.

Last edited on 03 September 2017 - 06:25 PM by LFT

How was map pool?: Map pool was good, good job to the map development team.

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?: I feel as there is an issue when it comes to the timer (respawn & map timer). Most maps I felt ended at approximately 00:02, it isn't a big issue, however it should be something looked into. As well as the same issue for the respawn timer, for instance, on the map 'Versatile'. I had an issue where I was spawning in at 6 seconds instead of the 8 which it said it was. I am not sure if I am just counting wrong, or if its counting fast, but it seems to be a bit off. Other than that issue, the times were completely fine for the maps played.

How was the livestream?: They did well, however maybe get another few players to stream other matches? Obviously, this will split viewers, however there were countless times where players asked for specific matches and the streamer was streaming the more 'interesting' matches. This is completely fine, but I just feel that more players streaming can help with that issue.

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?: Proper seeding, based off the CTF tournaments outcome. As well as maybe double elimination?

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?: Seems fine.

x——————————————————————————————————————————————-x
Congrats Rome! Still expect $10 from Jarl's cut :D.

Posted on 03 September 2017 - 06:39 PM

How was map pool? I think it was pretty good.

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine? I think it was good too.

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time. They were pretty good but maybe another stream could have been of use.

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney? Double elimination. Single elimination removes a lot of competition, and DE would be very good for the upcoming tournaments.

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all? It probably is alright, after discussing it with the staff.

Posted on 03 September 2017 - 08:28 PM

How was map pool?Very good map pool and veto system

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine? Too long

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time. Livestream was very nice since players couldn't spectate. Will specing every happen for private ctf or ctw games?

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney? More teams

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?Yea it seems fair to lock the top rosters.

Posted on 03 September 2017 - 08:50 PM

How was map pool? It was good.

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine? It was fine on most of the maps, although there was 1 where it was too short imo idk which one sadly :c

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time. Fine, sometimes they should have spectated more intense matches, at 1 point they were spectating pblox beating 5-0 a not very good team instead of Bait vs some team , which would have been an intense match to watch.

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney? OCN maps.

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all? It should be able to imo, due to the need of defenders for ctw.

Last edited on 03 September 2017 - 09:30 PM by Kiivo

Last edited on 03 September 2017 - 10:52 PM by Zicuri

How was map pool?
I liked it a lot but Basilica.
How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?
To be honest this should be implemented for the CTW tournament and Domination since it was pretty good aswell
How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time.
They know what they are doing, I wasn't able to watch the whole thing because stuff irl but I want to see Spanish and other languages streaming so more people can actually watch and stay, also I don't know if reshif and strangey did it but when they are waiting for a game or the game is being passive they should introduce or talk a little about what is CTF and competitive stuff
Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?
New maps, Spawn timer increase before 30mins, More streams, More teams and Double elimination system
Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?
It seems fine but they should be able to remove/add 2 people at least

Last edited on 04 September 2017 - 02:16 AM by Mattato

How was map pool?

Nothing too problematic, acceptable but definitely mediocre compared to some OCN tournaments.


How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?

Again, acceptable, but in the future I would like to see dynamic respawn timers, in which respawn times increase as the match goes on. I think it was/is especially important in static-objective gamemodes like CTF (and CP, AND DOMINATION).


How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time.

I think the finals were completely underhyped by the streamers, they seem to have lost their energy after like 6 hours of streaming (no surprise), and that contributed to a very unmemorable finale. To fix this, there should be 2-3 teams of 2 streamers each. Almost all the semi-finals and EVERY finals match should be covered in it's entirety. I think this can be done by having 1-2 teams of English speakers and 1 team of Spanish speaking streamers. This would allow more matches to be connected to by a more diverse group of players, which is beneficial to growing Badlion's competitive scene.

I think there's really 2 parts to a successful stream team. Strange and Reshif are among the most competent streamers because of their knowledge of the maps (as OCN players and as the mapdevs themselves) and I think they did a great job explaining the maps and how to push, so they were 10/10 analytically, but I didn't find them particularly entertaining. I think if you want to draw more players into watching Badlion 5v5s, entertainment is more important than analytics (since I feel like most badlion players dont know and dont care). The obvious comparison is Eclipsen, who managed to connect with every viewer of OCN tournament streams regardless of their (and his, lol) knowledge of how gamemodes like DTC worked.

I've seen a lot of worse streams and streamers and I think Strange and Resh deserve a huge hug for how they pulled it off last second though.


Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?

1. A 100% confirmed, crystal-clear veto system. I swear to god if some dumbass says randomize the maps I will cut
2. Only 1-2 Bo1 rounds, or, alternatively, if only all bo1 except for finals, a double elim bracket to compensate.

2.5 SUPER IMPORTANT - Fixing wool touches. If you touch a wool and the other team doesn't within the alloted time, you should win.

2.75 SUPER IMPORTANT - Adding support for proximity..? The closer you place a wool safety to the block region that you need to place the wool on to win (the monument) the better your proximity. (MAKE SURE IT WORKS IN FLOWING WATER TOO)

3. Fully tested, high-quality CTW maps that support a wide-array of playstyles, not orienting around control-based playstyles or communal skybridging. (Not Ring Race, but not NextGen with 1 side island) I suggest looking back and editing into 5v5 maps from OCN such Horseshoe Ranch, Terricreus (fuck u claf), and Wallop. I heard GD5 was going to be played, but there should be quality-of-life edits made to the map as well to keep it fresh.
4. Spawnkits regardless of whether there is better armour (like iron or gold) on the map or not. AND BALANCING ARMOUR with arrow damage (you shouldn't be 3-4 shot with a bow, ever)
5. Making defending balanced and not completely bullshit like it was on Swamplands or the snow mountain map by triple. Giving an appropriate amount of blocks to the defenders, making defending more traditional in general (because it is easier for Badlion players to pick up how to do it that way, if it is). Defending like clafs Gobi 5v5 > defending like Swamplands


Misc updates:
1. Allowing whitelisting spectators onto the scrimmage server
2. Allowing the leader of the party to kick players from the scrimmage roster (into observers or just off the server)
3. Creating a practice-server system where a party can choose to load a map without dueling another team, so they can take a look at the map and practice by themselves. (Should not be force joined, allow players to fly in obs for as long as they want before /joining, and shut-down the practice server (kick players back to hub) after an alloted amount of time (like 30 mins))


Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?

I think you should be able to rotate out any 2-3 players, not just ones that haven't played.

Posted on 04 September 2017 - 07:41 AM

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney? A new KB, since u take 0 kb rn, It cant be like this on CTW, the void is such a huge thing to keep in mind while pvping, knocking ppl out of the world is so important in a pvp.
And if possible try changing the dates for the ctw tm, since teams will need more time to pratise and sign up for it

Posted on 04 September 2017 - 07:58 AM

As for the low numbers the tournament wasn't hyped up at all. I'm not surprised that not many people signed up. Regardless it was a well organised tournament, thank you to everyone who made this a reality.

Maybe in the future try to get some big youtubers to announce " You, yes you, can win $1000! All you have to do is get 5 friends to play this new capture the flag tournament on September 2nd." Idk something cringy like that but people will do anything for money, even if they dislike CTF they should really turn up. But as I said there was basically no advertising.

Posted on 04 September 2017 - 08:01 AM

How was map pool?
OCN maps were good, the new ones were ok
How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?
Fine

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time.
The stream was good , but next time try to get 2 streamers or stream the most intense matches

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?
A new knockback , i dont get why the kb was changed like a week before the tourney , the kb that we have rn is really small, anyone can take 0 kb and thats not really good for ctw

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?

Maybe , 1-2 players prob

Last edited on 04 September 2017 - 10:40 AM by MCUnbreakable

How was map pool?
It was nice, I do prefer Outpost and Labyrinth over some of the new maps though x)


How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine?
Nothing to complain about?


How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time.
It would've been nice to have more than one livestream considering matches were at the same time. I understand watching PB was maybe more fun than watching other teams, but it's always fun to see how you did in a 3rd person view :3

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney?
Imo, if you want more Badlion players, the maps need to favor a little less block interaction. The maps should probably focus ground pushes over huge sky bridges because experienced teams will have have the upper hand in these situations and won't make it fun for the new competitors. In the future, adjusting the maps to favor a bigger diversity of options will be great. Though, I truly think simplifying CTW for this tourney will increase the interest for new players.

EDIT: Even reducing the number of maps where you actually need to craft your stuff will probably encourage teams for this tournament, baby steps x)

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all?
It seems like a fair option to have their rosters locked but I know how hard it can be to get everyone on, on time and if one or two players simply can't make it, that cuts their roster down quite a lot and it would really suck if a top team can't compete due to some unpredictable family problem that day, as example.

Posted on 05 September 2017 - 07:04 AM

How was map pool? It had some good maps but Basilica was kinda broken, having the gap spawner is an overpowered advantage

How was spawn timer? Too short, too long, fine? Fine

How was the livestream? Reshif streamed with Strangey this time. It was good, both resh and strange did a good job. For the next tms adding 1 more streamer would be nice.

Anything you want to see for the CTW tourney? Good maps

Thoughts on roster lock system for top teams? Should it be changed at all? I think there should be a roster repair either between of the CTW and the Koth tourney or before the big last tourney. _I dont think people can manage to know if they will be able to play in 2 and a half months