Posted on 13 June 2014 - 02:24 AM
Hello fellow Badlion PVPers,I've come to ask those of you better versed in knowledge about latency/connection issues than myself to explain this to me (and to everyone else who isn't sure / thinks they know but just accuse everyone who beats them of having "reach").
There are a few questions that I think we've all asked ourselves, especially if accused of HAVING reach/OP ping/better ms:
1. Is "reach" directly linked to your ping? If so, what ping is "better" and why?
2. What's the difference between getting combo'd by someone who's skilled and getting "8-block'd"?
3. If players can get "reach" over other players on factors other than ping, what are those factors and are there ways to improve one's "latency"?
I'm aware I may have botched many or all of these terms, so please be patient with me in your explanations. As someone who's been PVPing off and on for 2 years or so, it frustrates me that I've gotten dozens of different answers to these questions and occasionally been accused of an unfair advantage I didn't think I had/have after beating someone (and sometimes even if I lose O_o).
Thanks, and if you can't explain these things but think you know someone who can, please feel free to tag them.
@MasterGberry @frogmike @Azpiring @MetroSausage @BeatingOffToCats @Viprite
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 03:10 AM
-snip-Posted on 13 June 2014 - 03:17 AM
There's a post about it somewhere in the bugs section of le forumsPosted on 13 June 2014 - 03:22 AM
-snip-Posted on 13 June 2014 - 04:14 AM
Varicks wrote
viprite wrote...
@Viprite
Are you referring to this?
-snip-
Unfortunately, no.
The post I refered to is a network grid along the us and Europe which MasterGberry posted with a small explanation of how it works. The OP is combo if you want to find it
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 04:49 AM
Varicks wrote
But apparently (EU, anybody with foriegn connection to U.S) people get "reach." They've more ping. There hits delay and stack so to speak, which gives them more knockback. I don't know what causes people to have no knockback, or almost to none. Their knockback on your, from the hits that stack, simulate reach, making it where you can't hit them.
Was the 2nd half of your post your opinion? If not, please do share, because even if there is dissent or disagreement (perhaps from Gberry or others) I'd be happy to hear input from you.
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 05:21 AM
-snip-Posted on 13 June 2014 - 06:15 AM
Varicks wrote
Oh - so basically, regardless of opinions on WHY higher ping = better reach, it's invariably true that higher ping = better reach?
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 01:50 PM
Verilyx wrote
Oh - so basically, regardless of opinions on WHY higher ping = better reach, it's invariably true that higher ping = better reach?
No, I'm telling you what happens when this does occur. (8-block)
But as of request, since I'm not completely sure I'll snip it
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 01:55 PM
-snip-Posted on 13 June 2014 - 02:00 PM
I don't know alot on this topic, I'm just stating what I think I know. So don't take anything I say too seriously.On my current connection, I get ~15ms to gontroller & ~85ms to badlion.
When pvping on gontroller almost every player has a reach advantage over me, When pvping on badlion, most the time it's okay but sometimes players have reach over me.
I think about 75ms is among the best ping. IK that some/most of the top pvpers in gontrollers pvp ladder have about 80ms.
The reach seems to happen when people have a higher or lower ping than you. My best guess is that It is to do with packet priority.
The 'all eu player has op reach cos of there shitty ping' argument is a load of bs imho. The UK is currently installing fibre optic (fast broadband) to cover 95% of the homes in the UK. So some people already have it & some don't. There is obviously going to be a bit of delay, but when you look at this map:
You can see the UK has a good connection to USA (& New Jersey if thats where the server is located)?
I think it's more likely to be the case that we have a ping of ~75ms. Something else I don't think many people look into is knockback. The variety of kb I get is HUGE, yet it's hardly complained about. If one player gets more kb they basically force the opponent away & make combo'ing them easier. I always 'had a dream' of making a factions server where all players received the same kb (among with other cool fations stuff) but I haven't really made it, just from fear that it won't 'kick off'. Another Idea I had was to be to make a program/client that grabs the opponents ping & then delays your ping based on theirs (thereby giving you reach). I am hoping that 1.8 addresses this reach & knockback with their relog fix.
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 03:28 PM
it's random,sometimes i get reach,sometimes people get reach on me,but one thing is for sure,the lower your ping gets the better.Posted on 13 June 2014 - 04:01 PM
Sukamakey wrote
What I failed to realize is he's not looking for opinions, or what we think. He's asking for someone who's certain that they know.
Posted on 13 June 2014 - 04:42 PM
-snip-Posted on 13 June 2014 - 05:41 PM
Varicks wrote
Sukamakey wrote...
What I failed to realize is he's not looking for opinions, or what we think. He's asking for someone who's certain that they know.
IK ur not talking to me, but i don't think any1 'knows' and not many people even know about the issue. Badlion & hcf is probably got the most people who know it exists, most others say 'reach hacks' without knowing what they are even talking about. I think the best thing we could do would be to all talk about it and bash heads as not everyone has the same ping or has done definative tests.
This is my opinion on what could be happening.
Scenario 1
Player A has 1ms
Player B has 30ms
The distance of reach is so minimal it doesn't make a difference. Player A's hit packet is sent & reached by the server first thereby giving player A the 'reach'.
Scenario 2
Player A has 1ms
Player B has 250ms
Both players have forcefield on.
If you imagine player A standing still & player B running toward player A. Player B hits player A first, 249ms later player A can reach player B.
(I'm guessing the hit packet might be prioritised over the movement packet?)
However if player A is running toward player B player B should also download player A's location 249ms later. This is where we don't know what goes on. I presume there is some packet priority on the servers end that causes the problem.
A different theory on scenario 2 would be (will update later)
The only way to really see what the problem is, is to read the code of both client and server and do a fuck load of tests. Mojang probably don't even know that the problem exists, As far as they are concerned if you can't dupe diamonds they are happy.