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A big issue which needs to be looked at
Last edited on 24 April 2016 - 06:33 PM by Jinxful
Hello, as a regular badlion player, I'm very critical of the server and want to suggest things which should be in the best interests of the staff team to work on.OK, this thread has been made countless times, I'm sorry, but I just want to state my opinions
I have mixed opinions on the badlion maps
Badlion is a practice server. Arena PvP is supposed to give you a good environment to practice, which you can apply elsewhere. The maps are very important when it comes to ArenaPvP evidently as they SHOULD represent a real environment at which you would find yourself in a pvp situation. You however get unrealistic maps paired up with each ladder. For example, the UHC ladder has maps such as the constuction site, which you would not find in a real situation. In some of the Build UHC maps, you find obsidian pillars, again which you wouldn't find in a UHC. My point being that maps should represent the real situation of the ladder you are practicing. For instance, a Build UHC map could be a Plains biome in contrary to a map with pillars. There could also be a Build UHC map which has a desert theme around it, a map which represents a real UHC scenario. These maps will be optimized for arena PvP to stop camping etc.
Potion PvP and other gamemode maps. This is different really, you are practicing potion pvp not for a real situation (however you could argue HCF) This is why the maps don't necessarily have to be realistic. On the server kohi, I happily get 150-300 fps. On badlion, I get 60-150 which feels very choppy to my fps. I have also heard some of the blocks mess up renders. You need to make the maps better for fps, and help a fairer style of play to happen on those maps. Adding a 2 high pile of blocks for people to jumpshot is a bad idea, and has caused a lot of people to be opposed to the maps (Why I'm writing this). If you optimize the maps for fps, a fair stle of play ( I hope it's obvious on how to change the maps so people don't play like idiots) it will make ArenaPvP a better place to practice your PvP. Adding realistic maps for gamemodes like UHC will also help the idea of ArenaPvP's purpose of practicing your skills and applying them into play.
Thank you and I hope this thread makes change!
Last edited on 24 April 2016 - 07:03 PM by MrGberry
+1 honestly but the construction site is realistic because u often see things like that in an MCSG gamePosted on 24 April 2016 - 07:40 PM
Maps being fixed next season supposedly after many threads on it. Believe me, I share your fps problems, it's because the maps are grouped together tightly, so you have to load unnecessary chunks.Posted on 24 April 2016 - 09:18 PM
-1The way the map is created doesn't make my PVP skills better or worse.
Posted on 25 April 2016 - 03:14 AM
OkieMC it does. If there is a hill or something, purple just will camp on top and it creates unfair gameplayPosted on 25 April 2016 - 06:44 AM
@Jinxful but a hill would create gameplay that you would see it lets say a UHC with someone camping on top of a hill.Posted on 25 April 2016 - 07:29 AM
Hey just a thing can we make build maps smaller for 1v1s nobody needs that much spacePosted on 25 April 2016 - 07:31 AM
lol obsidian pillarshave you beat the ender dragon?
Posted on 25 April 2016 - 07:59 AM
1+ well yeah although I do agree with that, like OkieMC said dosen't make my pvp skills worse. But nice for a change. Should be implemented later seasons to come.(✧ω✧)
Posted on 25 April 2016 - 08:18 AM
The maps suckPosted on 25 April 2016 - 08:22 AM
@Hivlik tell me something newPosted on 25 April 2016 - 09:26 AM
Jinxful wrote
You however get unrealistic maps paired up with each ladder. For example, the UHC ladder has maps such as the constuction site, which you would not find in a real situation. In some of the Build UHC maps, you find obsidian pillars, again which you wouldn't find in a UHC. My point being that maps should represent the real situation of the ladder you are practicing. For instance, a Build UHC map could be a Plains biome in contrary to a map with pillars.
In a UHC you may find yourself in a situation where you pvp at the side of a lava pool in the nether. You may be ontop of a mountain and whoever gets knocked down dies. You may be in a plains biome with numerous waterpools to fall into and get stuck in. These are realistic situations, but arenas of this type would be absolute ass. Realism vs non-cancerous terrain is one of the most difficult matters we deal with and we usually try to aim for a good mix of the two. Some people would love to see completely flat maps, others want maps as close to the gamemode they're practising for as possible. I do agree that some of the current maps fit neither of these descriptions.
Keep in mind that while you may not play in a construction site in UHC, the gameplay can be similar. In UHC players can hide behind trees, in the construction map players can hide behind pillars.
Posted on 25 April 2016 - 09:56 PM
HalfCreeper wrote
reasonable stuff
Yes, those are all very lucid, well thought-out arguments, but you are missing a big big part of arena.
First of all, the way you see Arena PvP is a practice server; and as much as I would have agreed with you one year ago, I just don't think that's the case anymore. I'd say it is one of if not the most competitive gamemodes in Minecraft as a whole at the moment, and that in and of itself I think nullifies your argument that you might "be ontop of a mountain and whoever gets knocked down dies" in a UHC. Because maybe arena isn't just practice for UHC or Factions anymore; maybe it's a gamemode on its own.
But let's look beyond that - for the pure sake of argument, let's regard our Arena server as a practice server and nothing more. Even then, I'd still not support maps with excessive terrain or any sorts of structures because, at the end of the day, it's just a lot less fun. The thing about a practice server is that you will have the same maps, the same kits, the same scenarios every single time. That's something that you can't account for on a practice server. There's no way you can practice these players to be good at each and every single scenario they might encounter in a real pvp situation. Between different gamemodes and randomly generated maps, there will always be different scenarios in a "real" pvp endeavor. There are two types of skill that will factor into that fight in a UHC: mechanical skill and game sense. Game sense can only be obtained through countless fights in countless different situations, like being able to react from being cleaned up in a UHC or having to kite in factions; mechanical skill is something you can build and learn consciously, like sword/bow skills. A practice server should focus solely on helping players build their mechanical skill, because to try to teach them game sense on an artificial server would be, you guessed it, artificial. That doesn't help anybody.
So when you're designing a map for an arena server, you have to keep in mind that you don't want to be testing players on their game sense - their ability to play at a disadvantage (like getting camped) - but rather their mechanical skill - their ability to outskill the other player in an even fight. The best way to do that is to balance out every advantage, or get as close to that goal as possible, and flat maps with little terrain and no structures are 100% a step in the right direction.
Posted on 26 April 2016 - 05:43 AM
Hivlik wrote
HalfCreeper wrote...
Yes, those are all very lucid, well thought-out arguments, but you are missing a big big part of arena.
First of all, the way you see Arena PvP is a practice server; and as much as I would have agreed with you one year ago, I just don't think that's the case anymore. I'd say it is one of if not the most competitive gamemodes in Minecraft as a whole at the moment, and that in and of itself I think nullifies your argument that you might "be ontop of a mountain and whoever gets knocked down dies" in a UHC. Because maybe arena isn't just practice for UHC or Factions anymore; maybe it's a gamemode on its own.
But let's look beyond that - for the pure sake of argument, let's regard our Arena server as a practice server and nothing more. Even then, I'd still not support maps with excessive terrain or any sorts of structures because, at the end of the day, it's just a lot less fun. The thing about a practice server is that you will have the same maps, the same kits, the same scenarios every single time. That's something that you can't account for on a practice server. There's no way you can practice these players to be good at each and every single scenario they might encounter in a real pvp situation. Between different gamemodes and randomly generated maps, there will always be different scenarios in a "real" pvp endeavor. There are two types of skill that will factor into that fight in a UHC: mechanical skill and game sense. Game sense can only be obtained through countless fights in countless different situations, like being able to react from being cleaned up in a UHC or having to kite in factions; mechanical skill is something you can build and learn consciously, like sword/bow skills. A practice server should focus solely on helping players build their mechanical skill, because to try to teach them game sense on an artificial server would be, you guessed it, artificial. That doesn't help anybody.
So when you're designing a map for an arena server, you have to keep in mind that you don't want to be testing players on their game sense - their ability to play at a disadvantage (like getting camped) - but rather their mechanical skill - their ability to outskill the other player in an even fight. The best way to do that is to balance out every advantage, or get as close to that goal as possible, and flat maps with little terrain and no structures are 100% a step in the right direction.
Posted on 26 April 2016 - 04:30 PM
^^^^^^