Posted on 04 July 2016 - 12:58 AM
So, many people (me included) feel as if global elo is biased towards those who are better at melee, and for S13 I would personally love to see this more balanced. Especially now with no shared accounts, global would be a complete representation of the best overall player in all types of kits, not just melee or bow. I feel I am a little biased because I'm generally more decent at bow, but I know for sure that I am not the only player who is wanting more bow ladders for this same reason.When it comes to actually balancing, it can be a little difficult. I mean, there's Iron, Diamond (debatable) , UHC, Advanced UHC, Horse, and Archer. It's hard to break those down into more groups right? Well, here's what I propose; we separate archer into different kits, there could be an archer like the old archer, requiring bowspamming as well as fast reflexes, there could be another archer similar to Kohi's practice archer, with open maps, focusing on the more longshot type of bowing, and then we could also keep the current archer ladder, because it does a good job at being unique because of the distance-based damage.
So with this layout we would have 8/17 kits being bow-based, instead of the current 6/15 or less: (7/17 if you don't count diamond)
Iron - No Change
Diamond - No Change
UHC - No Change
Advanced UHC - No Change
Horse - No Change
Old Archer - 16 EPearls, Speed II, Leather Armor, No Regen
Kohi Archer - No EPearls, No Speed, Leather Armor, Regen
Archer - No Change
{Rest of Melee Ladders}
So please, don't instantly shut this idea down just because you favor melee, bowing is a huge factor in Minecraft pvp, and it should be represented in the global ladder as such. However, because I prefer bow ladders, I know that I'm biased, so I'd like to hear from the community, what do you guys think about to addition of more bow ladders in an effort to balance the global leaderboard?
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 02:47 AM
You do realize that there's only 3 ladders that are just melee, opposed to the other ladders that throw in a rod or bow. As a fan of gapple, the global leaderboards are heavily favored towards bow people, as in most of the ladders people can bow spam their way up the leaderboards, which is a lot more powerful than sword rushing, because you do it at any range.Posted on 04 July 2016 - 02:55 AM
one word; kohi archerPosted on 04 July 2016 - 04:27 AM
Lynkkis wrote
thts 2 words actually xdd
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 04:28 AM
Legendcaleb wrote
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 04:44 AM
Skillapp wrote
Lynkkis wrote...
thts 2 words actually xdd
Last edited on 04 July 2016 - 05:03 AM by MrZekk
Legendcaleb wrote
if u want it that way then the only actual bow ladder is archer because in the others there are swords
build uhc, mcsg, iron build, etc are balanced while the sword kits are kohi, no debuff, gapple, etc
so yeah we need more bow only ladder because we only have 1
Last edited on 04 July 2016 - 05:03 AM by MrZekk
double postLast edited on 06 July 2016 - 09:24 AM by Jahmyr
snipPosted on 04 July 2016 - 11:14 AM
I agree the melee is more important when both are present in a fight, but I also agree that melee has a few ladders exclusive to melee (GApple, Kohi…), while bow has only one kit exclusive to bowing. That is why I'd love to see more bow exclusive ladders.Posted on 04 July 2016 - 05:44 PM
Treatise wrote
Legendcaleb wrote...
You're clearly one of those people to think bow is a terrible skill that does not deserve to be in existence in this game:
Told me that on an alt :)
Okay? People constantly use the bow in diamond for combos and I'm only saying that ladders like nodebuff gapple and kohi require a lot of skill because you can't just hang back and now behind a wall
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 05:45 PM
HarrisAz wrote
Legendcaleb wrote...
if u want it that way then the only actual bow ladder is archer because in the others there are swords
build uhc, mcsg, iron build, etc are balanced while the sword kits are kohi, no debuff, gapple, etc
so yeah we need more bow only ladder because we only have 1
But which is more useful? Bow always trumps sword, think of ladders like uhc where the sword is practically useless. You can't sword rush a skilled bowman but you can bow spam a skilled swordsman
Last edited on 04 July 2016 - 06:09 PM by Hypnotic
Legendcaleb wrote
But which is more useful? Bow always trumps sword, think of ladders like uhc where the sword is practically useless. You can't sword rush a skilled bowman but you can bow spam a skilled swordsman
This is kind of off the topic, but a good enough melee'er can still rush a decent bowspammer, especially in kits like build.
And I agree, kits like GApple or NoDebuff require a completely different skill than Diamond and Build, because of the ability to do ranged KB. I wouldn't say one requires more skill than the other, but the whole point of this thread is to get more exclusive bow ladders, just like how there are exclusive melee ladders; because as of now, it is more important to learn bowless melee, because it will get you a better global elo.
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 06:09 PM
That's not super balanced considering that most melee kits have bows in them (I'm pretty sure there is no non speed ladder that does not have a bow.) Bow already plays a huge factor in global. I personally think another sg and build kit would be beneficial for global. Players who are good with rod and secondaries should have a better chance at global elo. An SG deathmatch kit (full iron, diamond sword, bow, rod, 12 arrows, 3 gapples, food, fns.) and dual wielding build kit (stronger armor and sword than build, dual wielding a s2 fire 1 iron sword, 10 gaps 5 heads, and the usual build items excluding the lava bucket.)Posted on 04 July 2016 - 06:09 PM
And bow is my strength so you can't say I'm biased.Last edited on 04 July 2016 - 06:16 PM by Hypnotic
Bain_ wrote
I agree, bow already plays a part in many of the kits, but there are a few kits that have only melee, while there is one kit that has only bow. That's why I'm hoping for this change.
btw you also bring up a good point in that pvp isn't just bow and sword. should we also make sure all other skills are accounted for equally such as rodding?
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 06:20 PM
Legendcaleb wrote
5 right?
Vanilla, Nodebuff, Kohi, IronSoup, and GApple
Unless you are arguing that most good players actually use bow in pot ladders. (Which may be true, but I don't think so)
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 06:23 PM
There does need to be a better balance. Though I am better at melee than bow, there does need to be some balance. You can count SG as the only kit that bow is just as important as melee. So if there would be a balance, add the balance on 1.9 because there are only 2 bow ladders out of the 8 and SG, which is balanced.Posted on 04 July 2016 - 06:47 PM
Legendcaleb wrote
HarrisAz wrote...
But which is more useful? Bow always trumps sword, think of ladders like uhc where the sword is practically useless. You can't sword rush a skilled bowman but you can bow spam a skilled swordsman
Posted on 04 July 2016 - 07:18 PM
Treatise wrote
Legendcaleb wrote...
And who decided that? Obviously bow people