Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:05 PM by Always_Unhappy

Badlion <3,
I've been a Donator on Badlion for quite some time now. Prior to Factions, UHC, The Multiple Different ArenaPvP Servers, or any of the other more recent updates. I've been on MineCraft long enough to watch servers evolve. Badlion use to have a steady 100 people online, and those numbers have clearly multiplied. The server has had updates, there's more kits, gamemodes, and ranks. The server is changing for the better, but you need to let the community apply their technique's whilst PvPing.

I know this isn't the first thread about Butterfly Clicking, and I'm sure it won't be the last. I wanted to give the Badlion community an opportunity to redeem ourselves with this decision bestowed upon us. I don't plan on making any aggressive statements towards the server or the people that share their personal opinions with me on this particular thread. I wish to have a mature and stabilized conversation about the decision of making Butterfly Clicking a bannable offense.

As I stated before, there's very few people that can say they have been here since the beginning - back when Nodus and Huzuni were a servers biggest issue. For anybody who has been in the competitive MineCraft group for a decent amount of time would agree that PvPing has drastically changed. Does anybody else remember when Ender pearls were used to escape from enemies, only one or two speed potions were necessary during a fight, or quake pro was "the best" option for PvP because people believed you could hit enemies from farther away. We've grown past those limitations and broke the barrier into a new era of competitive game play.
Now Ender pearls are used to be more aggressive, people bring at least 3+ potions(depending on the game mode/server), and people are no longer puking their brains out from Quake Pro.

People have their own styles. Isn't that why Badlion allows for people to create a custom kit for their favorite ArenaPvP games? Personally, I keep my ender pearls on 9, and my Carrots on 8. My Speed potions are always on the far left of my inventory, and I refill my potions from left to right. That is the style that I have developed over my years playing minecraft. Not everybody uses this loadout though. There's plenty of people who actually prefer the exact opposite, but this is an option that Badlion gives us, as we are able to edit the kits we use. This does NOT put anybody at an advantage because the entire server is capable of doing so. Isn't that similar to Butterfly Clicking? Every individual has the ability to do this (assuming you have 2+ fingers <3). It does not put one user at an advantage over another. In fact, it allows for the Badlion community to develop a more comfortable sense of how they prefer to PvP, which (in my opinion) is a very important factor when playing on a server for several hours at a time.

Not everybody can have "gaming sessions" lasting as long as they wish, so learning to Jitter Click is not always the best option. If people want to get better at PvP, one of the essential things to learn would be click speed. The Combo Kit is a perfect example of why click speed can be important. It takes away any factor in MineCraft that would allow for hit delay. In simpler terms: every single time you click, they take damage. Again, not everybody has the time to adapt to Jitter Clicking, and I would say the average speed of clicking normally would be about 5-6 CPS. Literally half of what most Jitter Clickers can achieve. Butterfly Clicking is not difficult to learn, which makes it easy for people with less time to enjoy the server. Imagine that the typical amount of clicks per second with one finger was 6, that would mean it would maximize at 12 clicks per second with two fingers. If the player is able to constantly maintain their click speed, then that is great, but that isn't the case. We aren't robots. People make mistakes, and sometimes you click at the same time with both fingers! It's not realistic to say somebody that Butterfly clicks could achieve 20+ CPS, unless they are the duo Jitter Clicking finger champion. Even if 20CPS was achievable like this, the user would be risking their accuracy for click speed, which lowers their advantage to the point that it is useless to do so.

I've done my fair share of reading posts about this topic. I've noticed that both sides have decent opinions on the matter, but most people against Butterfly Clicking are obviously not users of this specific technique. So I want to propose a question to the people that seem to be determined to eliminate Butterfly Clicking: What if it was bannable to click more then 8 times per second? It might not be a fair comparison through your eyes, but most people can click at least 8 times with their comfortable techniques. I ask you this question because it seems unreasonable, right? It might get rid of a few cheaters that are auto-clicking, but it will also falsely ban people that are able to click at that speed. So, if this was a rule, everybody would need to change their style of PvP to match the servers requirements, which doesn't seem very ideal to most of the community. I know that this thought process isn't as realistic, as there aren't TOO many people that Butterfly Click, but I think it was a decent way to put things into perspective.

P.S - The reason I chose 8 CPS is because anything more then that is pretty much useless…. MineCraft targets can only be attacked 4 times per second. <– So why would it be so bad to allow butterfly Clicking? It might be pointless to some people, but it helps others.

I understand that Archybot stated neither owner wanted to change the Butterfly Clicking rule (As of December 6th, 2015), but I'm attempting to put this into perspective from all points of view, as well as hoping that their opinions could change after reading this.

I know a lot of people think that Butterfly Clicking can give people a clicking advantage (in terms of REAL clicks per second - not just the ones registered in game), but as I've stated before, it is something that people would need to sacrifice accuracy for to gain clicks per second. If you know the specifics and do the math about CPS compared to Accuracy, you'll realize that better PvPers are actually less accurate, because their click speeds are increasing. Which leads me to personally believe that Butterfly Clicking could be more advantageous then Jitter Clicking. This should not be derived in a negative manner, though. Jitter Clicking was believed to be more advantageous than regularly clicking, but that received much less attention. Butterfly Clicking may or may not be better then Jitter Clicking, but I believe most of the top PvPers would stick to Jitter Clicking, despite the decision created from this thread.

If you couldn't tell already I'm very passionate about making my self clear on things I do or do not agree with. I DO NOT want this thread to become toxic, or receive hate in any way - although some things are just inevitable. I want there to be a mature discussion, and potentially a more professional discussion between players and possibly staff. I wouldn't mind jumping into TeamSpeak and having a developed discussion with anybody, as long as it remains mature and on topic. To branch from this, I think some people might be wondering why I'm creating this thread in the first place, aside from the fact that I'd like to PvP with my comfortable defaults. I'm a LiveStreamer looking to get back into the business big time. I'm currently sitting at about 4,000 followers and 40,000 channel views. I've been trying to Jitter Click and Regular Click on Badlion, but I cannot match up to my abilities when Butterfly Clicking on similar servers. I still would like to take my viewers to Badlion, although I still would like to Click with my preferred settings.

I think it's essential that I mention my opinions of people who have already been banned by GCheat for this are addressed. I'm not going to argue for any unbans, as I am in no position to do so, and I'm not necessarily even sure that's an option for multiple reasons. I would like to point out that if Butterfly Clicking is so frowned upon, then perhaps make a rule for specific personnel where you must record when Butterfly Clicking with a HandCam or something of the sort. It will easily become annoying and people will need to record the entire time they are online in preparation for a false ban, but I know I would be one of the few people to still do so.

I think the last thing that needs to be touched upon is the fact that Clicks can be registered twice while Butterfly Clicking. There's two ways to look at this, and I think it's important for me to state both of them.
1- People will be able to click too fast without any extra work, which is bad because it is (unintentional) cheating.
2- GCheat is flawed and needs to be fixed.
I know this portion of the thread will probably receive a lot of hate, so I want to gently restate this. Depending on peoples perspective of Butterfly Clicking, the responses towards "GCheat being flawed" will vary. Some people do not think it is bad, which would mean that GCheat is falsely banning. Other people (the code for GCheat inclusive) would agree that double clicking is not possible and would be ruled as an "Unfair Advantage." In my personal opinion - GCheat is not falsely banning because it is responding accordingly to the way it was coded.

I lied. The last thing I need to talk about is the "One Click" rule or however you all will remember it.

Again there are different ways of looking at this rule.
The way I see it is that with Butterfly Clicking, one button is being used, one finger is being used, and one click is being created. The only difference is that your fingers are alternating to enhance the total CPS. Also, the majority of people that Jitter Click prefer to use two fingers (one on top of the other) to stabilize their mouse and finger. I think this means that the real issue with Butterfly clicking would be that it is allowing people to achieve more clicks per second, regardless of the amount of fingers it takes. If using multiple fingers was really the issue, then why can people use one finger to left click and another to right click?
Here's where the counter opinion comes into play. I've just stated that clicks per second might seem to be the issue, but there are multiple different threads that show the STAFF of Badlion admitting that higher CPS doesn't make you better. In which case, why aren't auto-clickers set to 100 CPS allowed? I don't actually want this allowed, I understand its advantages, but I'm sure at least one person has thought this before, too.

I'm not sure what Badlions main focus is (in terms of Butterfly Clicking) at this point, but I'm honesty intrigued to find out. Please remember that I don't want any wars to start on this thread, as it won't solve any issues. Please only comment with mature thoughts or opinions on the idea of allowing Butterfly Clicking, even if recording (while online) is mandatory.

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 07:59 PM

+1 Agree

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 07:59 PM

tldr jesus christ this is a novel

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:02 PM

Honestly, who's going to read this entire thing? lmao

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:03 PM

I agree with this post. I've been banned by gcheat because of butterfly clicking, I believe that butterfly clicking shouldn't be ban able because its just another way to click. #MakeBadlionGreatAgain

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:06 PM

You read 14 long paragraphs in about 1 minute or less young man, if I didn't know any better I would say you are an alt made to agree with the original post.

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:08 PM

I did lel.

I hope staff take this into consideration because there are a lot of good points in here, and so much effort was put into it. I'm not able to butterfly click with my mouse because it's so small but everyone has there own play style and should be able to use it (This can include butterfly clicking.) Literally every other server allows it, why can't badlion? I understand something would need to happen with GCheat but other than that it would be harmless.

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:09 PM

He's not an alt. He's a troll friend of mine and I told him to read the thread :)
He probably didn't even read the title.

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:12 PM by Cavasi

It's bad to allow butterfly clicking because not every mouse can butterfly click.

Now you might say not every mouse can jitterclick either and that's where you're wrong.

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:11 PM

I appreciate you reading this, it means a lot! Sorry for the wall of text! I'm not necessarily looking for people to specifically agree, just want to ensure that all the opinions are heard.

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:14 PM by UnarmedxD

hi

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:17 PM by Always_Unhappy

It's easier to Butterfly click with certain mouses compared to others.
It's easier to Jitter Click with certain mouses compared to others.
It's easier to Auto-Click compared to either of those two.


It's also easier to win fights when you have a better ping.
It's easier to win fights when you have more FPS (to an extent)
It's easier to PvP with a mouse, compared to a trackpad.

People can argue about what's easier and what's available for everybody. This doesn't mean somebody should have to adjust their settings to make it perfectly equal to their opponent. If I'm fighting somebody with 20 FPS, that doesn't mean I need to lower mine from 300+.

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:18 PM by UnarmedxD

+1 I agree with everthing he just said. Not fair to ban a clicking style because not every mouse can do it

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:42 PM by Cavasi

Im an idiot :(
and im wrong oops

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:39 PM by bhadd

You're my idiot :)

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:38 PM

<3 No you're not :)

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:41 PM

Actually a really good argument. Some computers can run 60fps, some can't. The computers that can run 60fps will have an advantage over the ones that can't run 60fps. Do we now ban the computers that run 60fps?

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:42 PM by ty_rex222

I could jitter on
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/318D41WBWDL._SY300_.jpg
when I had it lol.
I can't butterfly click on my mouse tho. Believe me, I've tried many times & techniques.
Edit: That came out weird. My mouse isn't an apple mouse anymore lol.

Last edited on 04 March 2016 - 08:45 PM by bhadd

I actually don't see why we care.

Posted on 04 March 2016 - 08:47 PM

So just because you cant butterfly click you think it should be a ban able offence? Its just a clicking technique I don't even see why its banned in the first place. Why don't they just ban jitter clicking because not everyone can do it.